Before my first girlfriend was my girlfriend, she was my friend. Wait, that might be a bit of a stretch. She was an associate. A classmate, in fact. I saw her everyday and while I didn’t pay a lot of attention to her, I did notice when she would come to class with swollen eyes. Her girlfriend would smack her around a little. She was beyond a whore, the supreme and ultimate flirt and her girlfriend felt that she had to smack her in order to keep her in line.
Obviously, that didn’t work. She kinda left her girlfriend. For me. I thought they were broken up, but it turns out that she had only broken up with the girl in her mind. When the girlfriend found out, she attacked her. It happened in front of me and another couple. It was a scary situation.
I made a promise to her that I would never treat her that way, but I’ll admit, I came close. She cheated on me too. I remember confronting her about it and looking at her so intently that my thoughts of smacking the daylights out of her was written all over my face. She told me to go ahead and hit her if it would make me feel better. She said she wouldn’t hit me back. She would rather have me hit her than stay mad.
I’ve dated a few women that seemed surprised when I would say to them that if they hit me, they would not have the opportunity to do it again. Now I’m not sure how the subject even came up, but I think it’s a red flag when you even have a conversation like that. It’s a bigger red flag when the person is surprised by that statement.
I’ve only been in one relationship where I felt afraid. I moved twice and changed my number to get away from one girl. My fear wasn’t that she would do something to me, it was that she would hurt herself and I would be left picking up the pieces…But that’s another story. I just remember feeling so uncomfortable around her and I can’t imagine being able to continue in a relationship with that kind of discomfort.
I have to wonder in the case of domestic violence, do people think it’s ok in the gay community because it’s not man vs woman? If we are the same sex and we are fighting, does it make it any better?
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As far as it being ok in the gay community…I’m thinking that people look at men being dominant–ie stronger with the capacity to do serious damage to a woman. You always here the saying, “A woman can never beat a man.” If two women or men are fighting, they are looked at as equals. So some people might think it is okay. The larger community doesn’t see the relationships as “real” so they don’t look at it as domestic violence. This is crazy.
But as I have said before, I do think there is a difference between getting abused and fighting–although that line is thin. I am like you though. You won’t get a second chance. Fighting nor abuse are signs of a healthy relationship and I would be OUT!
Curious to know what the difference is? Do you have to be in a relationship with someone in order for it to be abuse?
I assume you mean romantic relationships, and I say no. Friends abuse friends, too.
I mean relationships period. Family, friends or lovers. Is fighting normally done with people you have no ties to?
In my mind, abuse is continuous and degrading– and mentally damaging as physical damaging. This usually has no real empitous behind it and can’t be rationalized by any means.
Fighting is just that–a fight. Usually bought on by the fact that communication skills are lacking. This can be talked out. I was never one of those people that if we fight, we can be friends and sit down and talk it out; so that doesn’t work for me.
Anyone can be involved in an abusive relationship…doesn’t matter if you are dating, family, or whatever. I
hmmm I don’t know what to think. I always want to see what lead up to the hitting. I guess I’m just optimistic to think that everyone has a little good in them and that some just make some “uh oh’s” But I don’t think I would let it continue. And not just physical abuse but mental too.
But I do think that people view gay and lesbian abuse as small. I think they see two men and go “they can fight back” , then look at two woman as ” they can’t really hurt each other” That is why DV in the Gay community isn’t really reported a lot. I think a lot of people believe a woman can really hurt anyone… un less they are fighting over a man. *rolls eyes*
I know girls that have been bitten and stabbed. I guess that kind of pain doesn’t count?
only if it marres her beauty..blink
Why does it matter “what led up to the hitting?” Are there any circumstances where its OK to respond by hitting? (Besides getting hit first). That statement seems to Beg for an excuse to the hitting. Like “oh Rhianna must have hit him first”… Even IF she did, did she deserve that level of response from Chris? There is NEVER a good reason to put your hands on ANYONE, short of self defense. Even so “self defense” means stopping an attack from continuing… not whooping up on someone because “they started it”.
Hey Tmboy! Thanks for joining in. And you’re right. No circumstance should earn someone physical abuse.
Abuse (verbal, emotional & physical) has a bullying aspect to it. The abuser is usually more dominate, confrontational (without cause) and in some cases irrational and in extreme cases, sadistic.
There should not be any cases of domestic violence that are deemed “ok”. It shouldn’t matter if it is 2 men, 2 women or whether or not there is any potential (or perceived potential) for physical harm.
Agreed.
Domestic violence is never okay. It’s interesting how it seems to be lumped into categories where there need be none. Just because a woman won’t stop talking to you or may be getting in your face, yelling, screaming or acting an utter fool doesn’t give one license to use physical force. I grew up with domestic violence, in the form of pushing to the ground, not hitting. Later on I was “dating” a woman and one day she found a letter that I’d written to another girl and she hit me in my face. Up to that point I had never once experienced domestic violence in any relationship. Granted, I was much stronger than her in every way so I could have easily knocked her out, but I didn’t because I simply could not go there. I left the relationship although she begged me to stay. We are now very close friends and we have talked about the subject boften. The general consensus is that no matter what I did she had no right to put her hands on me. I agree. There is No excuse and I’m not about to give any. Good topic. -1-
No matter what you did you had no right to put your hands on her? But she can hit you? Does strength matter?
I think a lot of studs/doms/tomboy feel that way. Because we are the “aggressive” personality or we may feel/look physically stronger we dont strike back. The rule stands “you dont put your hands on a woman” EVER. Even if she hits you its not a good look for you to hit her back. “Take it like a man”, leave the psycho alone and keep it moving. I dont think “stud with swagg” was saying that the girl was allowed to hit her. But that it wasn’t ok to hit her back. Just because someone hits you doesnt mean you HAVE to hit back. You can walk away. In the case of DV you end the relationship, NO EXCEPTIONS. I would not date a woman that would forgive ME for hitting her… not ok. I take it as a sign that there’s something wrong with her. I think femmes should never date a dom that is surprised that she would at least defend herself if attacked. Those people expect you to be punching bags…
Good points!
Agree w/ Deborah 100%!
This is a good topic.
I think people do look at same-sex couples fighting and abusing one another as less severe, not as big of a deal as a straight couple because it’s not man on woman. I think it’s because there’s such a widespread belief that men are stronger than women…but often that strength and size difference exists between two women in a relationship as well. I’m 5′11 and weigh almost 300 and my ex is 5′5 and weighs 125. Just because we’re both women, it doesn’t suddenly make it okay for me to beat on her.
I know a few people who do somewhat enjoy a good physical fight with their lover. Not beating to the point of bruises and bleeding, but just a good rough pushing around and hair pulling. They seem to get off on it. They live for that passion…sitting down and talking about their hurt feelings or whatever doesn’t do it for them. They wanna choke each other and just have it out that way and are seemingly fine when it’s over. I personally don’t think it’s healthy or productive.
Someone else commented that they are interested in what led up to the physicality and that is a good point. It’s not ever okay for a situation to escalate to violence, and everyone teaches children that from a young age, that violence isn’t the answer and it’s never right for a man to put his hands on a woman…..but in the movie “the family that preys” when sanaa lathan’s character got blasted in the face, everyone cheered their ass off. People got satsifaction out of her getting hit like that. It’s like saying that if someone is a big enough of a bitch, then they deserve to get hit. I don’t think that’s right either…physical abuse isn’t the answer to emotional, mental, and verbal abuse.
I’m sad to say that I was one of those people that cheered when she got smacked in the movie. My view changed when I watched it with someone that had some violent tendencies. Does it matter if they get a quick smack or if it’s a punch?
Wow. This is a powerful topic. I am writing from the perspective of someone who abused an ex. To give a little background I was an R.A. in college and went through D.V. training etc. I never thought myself capable of being abusive until my relationship ended and I looked back over our years together and realized how abusive I had been (verbally.)
At the time, the language and words I used (I believed) were intended to help my ex, get herself to a better place: a healthier one. Fortunately, I have learned a lot since the relationship ended and that it was never my place to try to do this but rather just be supportive and appreciate her for who she is. I would say things to her out of my own discomfort with being with someone that didn’t care for themselves. I harped on issues because I thought if I didn’t she would “forget” and not want to better herself. The more things didn’t change the more I would use sarcasm and jokes to bring up issues such as weight and cleanliness.
It took my ex just not coming home one day to “check myself.” I went through / still am going through a long self-discovery process. I guess what I want to say is that anyone is capable of being abusive and even worse, not even realize that they are doing it. Alix, your comment about wanting to “smack the daylights out of her” is really important for all your readers to hear, as anyone can become abusive; it is something to be aware of.
I didn’t even think about verbal abuse when I wrote this. I know from experience that words can be just has hurtful as fists.
Yeah, I did want to smack the daylights out of her, but as a person that’s never been in a fight, I knew that I wouldn’t do it. It didn’t stop my hand from itching though…
Hell no. It’s unacceptable period. I don’t care what your sexuality is or what your gender is everybody should keep their hands to themself. I’ve been in an abusive relationship before in my past life. I’ll be damned if I be in one during this life.
Be strong!
Mos Def
Shit, Pup, I did not know about this history of yours! It makes your original acceptance of the bullshit surrounding SH a little more understandable.
I gotta quit typing because I got this gash on my hand and have been overdoing it today, so I’m not gonna read any other comments, for fear they’ll make me write more. But NO, of course it makes no difference if it’s same sex violence! Violence is violence and is not okay!
But you knew that! You’re just trying to stir up controversy! Hahah!
Lol, you knew I had stolen girlfriends before, or is that not what you meant about SH? And stop typing!
Hahah, see? You’re so used to it you didn’t even know what I meant! Of course I knew you’d stolen girlfriends before, ya little hussy, but what I was referring to was all the violent drama surrounding SH. It seemed so red flaggish to me, but less so to you, and with this other piece of info I’m thinking it was less red flaggish to you because it wasn’t out of the realm of your experience. That’s all.
The closest I’ve ever come is when I once slapped Jo across the face, among friends, in a bar, for not backing me up over someone’s racist/anti-semitic comments. There wasn’t actual PAIN involved, just embarrassment. And she fucking deserved it. I’d have slapped the man who was making the comments, but I didn’t know him well enough — which sort of goes back to the “relationship” theory.
I agree with you, that it doesn’t have to be a lover relationship, but those to whom we’re closest always have the greatest ability to drive us mad!
That slap was such a shock to me — not only because I don’t believe in violence, but because a face slap is so damn GIRLY!
Unlike you, I’ve been in many fights, bar fights, with asshole strangers, all of whom were men. And it was all very long ago. My violent responses dwindled along with my physical strength. In my youth, when I was tough and strong, physicality was a self-defense option (I was never the instigator), but age and injuries made me have to sharpen my tongue, instead.
Now MORE age, post-menopausally, I just walk away, don’t even need to kick ass with my tongue. Unless I’m drunk, of course.
I suppose that part of my history was something I’ve never mentioned because it was such an insignificant part of my experiences. Especially since I’ve never been a victim or the aggressor.
When I mentioned those closest to us, I was thinking more along the lines of it being abuse because of the relationship. Strangers are just fights because they don’t have any connection to our lives.
And of course, I knew you were a fighter. Drunk or sober, lol…
I “attacked” a male ex once (well attempted to). I kind of lunged at him but he held my wrists. I also threw something in his general direction once. Not proud of this at all. And this is with someone of the opposite sex. I don’t ever want to be that person again…or even get a glimpse of her. I saw images of my mother (who I watched get physical with boyfriends on numerous occasions) flash before my eyes. I pushed my ex gf out of my way once when we were both drunk. These may not seem like serious incidents but I really didn’t like the person that I saw in myself. I don’t think there’s any excuse for use of physical force between men and women or women and women other than self defense.
It’s good that you’re aware that you have this in you. You can monitor it and know when you’re about to reach your limits. It’s even better that you know where it’s coming from.
The first time I got hit I was a senior in high school.
I was standing in my bathroom bumping my ponytail for a volleyball game.
My 23 year old boyfriend who still lived with his mom felt like I should skip my game and go out with him. This was not an option; I was the captain of the team. My age and attitude at the time did not allow me to put it in a way that his age and ego could accept so he popped me in my right eye. I say popped because had he actually punched me he was big enough and strong enough to have knocked me across the room… Which I found out later. My instant reaction was to lay my curling iron on his face (almost a straight line down the forehead across the eyelid and right cheek) I think that’s what the report said. Anyway I felt so disgusted with myself even though he called himself checking me or scaring me whatever; at the time I was “in love”.
So I bought him some wheels for his car his mom purchased for him and we stayed together for about another 2 years only the next time he felt like swinging he made sure it hurt. Physically I have never shown signs of abuse, meaning nobody knew but me and him and his sorry mother. (Whole different issue.) But it was the end when I decided I was done didn’t feel it anymore, He hit me with his car, followed me home and pulled a gun out on me and my friends, called my friends houses and told them he was going to blow their shit up it was way too much to be dealing with at that age. I wasn’t sure at the time what I was feeling but I knew that I would never feel or make anyone I said I love feel the way I felt when I was with him.
Karma is a bitch though because although I had to leave town he ended up having some type of breakdown tried to kill himself and a few years later named his first kid after me (HE WAS A SICK F&^K) His momma made him that way.. I had no idea that I would hit back but I did all the time it was constant It would be a toss up as to which F_ing we would be doing at any time.
No way to live even for young and dumb. My first and last abusive relationship.
I can’t imagine at this point in my life letting something bother me enough to raise my hand to someone I love.
We all learn from our experiences. Otherwise there is no reason for us to go through the bs…
Ok so my final point is that I think one should only hit back if they can’t walk away after the first strike. If you gotta fight for your safety fight, but sometimes its better to just leave the nutty people alone instead of getting into a cycle. BUT like the person above me, pop me in the eye and my brain may not act quickly enough to lay your behind out… but it will try and chastise me afterward for acting without thinking.
Adrenaline is a SOB…
violence is violence. If I see it happening, I don’t care if She is a good friend or not, I’m calling the police. I’m not down with it.
*waves ay Mermaid* Long time, no see.
how mad would you be if you called the police and the victim opted not to file charges?